Post by MarkPost by AlanPost by NewsPost by EdmundPost by NewsPost by EdmundPost by GeoffVER forces NOR off track at first corner and all is OK "after all
it is the first corner of the race"....
Near the end, VER forces NOR off the track, going off-track
himself, and it is NOR gets a penalty.
How does that work ?
It works as it always work, some drivers are more equal then others.
Other then that, the rules!! IF they are applied here, suck big time.
The start where mad max goes way too fast to make the corner AND
leave space for others..... that is ruled OK! which is absurd.
BTW I am pretty sure max went off track during the race and kept
position BECAUSE he went of track, nobody cares.
Boo F1'riggin Hoo
https://adamcooperf1.com/2024/10/22/horner-norris-us-gp-penalty-was-
a- slam-dunk/
Much to my surprise Horner is backing his team.
Do you have a opinion of your own?
Horner speaks for me.
The difference is that Horner understands that it's easy to get back
ahead in the braking zone for a corner...
...by simply easing off the brake pedal.
You won't be able to stay on the track, mind, but your car's nose will
be back in front.
There have been a number of articles about this (understandably) which
all seem to add up to "What Verstappen did is almost certainly legal -
even if it's in a grey area - but should it be?".
I can't find the really good, deep discussion on this, but Brundle's
https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/13238684/martin-brundle-on-united-states-gp-lando-norris-battle-with-max-verstappen-and-subsequent-penalty-analysed#:~:text=And%20so%20started%20a%20string,and%20a%20pass%20seemed%20inevitable.
From memory, the more involved discussion was related to the fact that
Verstappen was treated as the defending driver for the purposes of the
rules, but that it's not clear that he wasn't (in principle) passed on
the straight, and that he shouldn't have been treated as the attacking
driver for the purposes of the corner passing regulations.
If that were to be the case, the obligations on him are different. The
dive-bombing tactic wouldn't be a legitimate defence of the racing line,
and the forcing of Norris off-track while *not* actually staying
on-track himself wouldn't be treated the same. If he'd had to make the
corner and leave space, he'd have to have braked sooner, and he'd have
had to cede the lead was lost.
...BUT all of this has to be considered, processed and a decision taken
in next to no time. I think that what the stewards decided under the
circumstances and given the understanding of the rules was correct. In
the cold light of day, however, does there need to be a clarification -
to the drivers, the stewards or even a specific change in rules - to
remove some of the grey area?
It just doesn't "feel right" that a driver can engineer a situation
where their failure to slow in time for the corner gets to benefit from
forcing another driver off-track without making the turn legitimately
themselves. If Verstappen had forced Norris wide while making the corner
on-track I *still* think it needs a review - there is the question of
whether he needed to leave space - but not making the corner just looks
like abuse of the rules and something that needs addressing.
I agree that even if Verstappen had stayed on the track, it should be
against the rules to force another driver off track once he has gained
position and you have room and time to choose a line that leaves him room.
The funny thing is that those same guidelines I posted pretty much make
this clear for passing on the inside:
'1. Guidelines for overtaking on the inside of a corner:
“In order for a car being overtaken to be required to give sufficient
room to an overtaking car, the overtaking car needs to have a
significant portion of the car alongside the car being overtaken and the
overtaking manoeuvre must be done in a safe and controlled manner, while
enabling the car to clearly remain within the limits of the track.
When considering what is a ‘significant portion’ for an overtaking on
the inside of a corner, among the various factors that will be looked at
by the stewards when exercising their discretion, the stewards will
consider if the overtaking car’s front tires are alongside the other car
by no later than the apex of the corner.”'
<https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/doc_2_-_2022_imola_event_-_fia_f1_driving_standard_guidelines.pdf>
So why should a different standard apply to an outside pass?
Norris's front tires were not only "alongside" at a point satisfying "no
later than the apex", he was actually ahead.
For me, this always comes back to leaving the other car room and time.
You can't barge down the inside too late, because that leaves the car
you're overtaking no time to change its line to stay on the track.
You shouldn't be able to take away a position gained on the outside by
letting off your own braking and leaving the overtaking car no room to
stay on the track.