Discussion:
Which one is the liar ?
(too old to reply)
M2T
2018-08-23 16:20:04 UTC
Permalink
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.

Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sir Tim
2018-08-23 22:54:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like Fred’s ego won’t allow him to accept the fact that none of the
top teams want him.

Horner has already bluntly rejected the idea of employing him because of
his tendency to “cause chaos” and I see that Dr Marko has now said that
Alonso "doesn't fit with us. We were negotiating with him in 2007 or 2008.
His demands were very tedious back then. If you look at his history, in
McLaren and Ferrari, it was always a one-man show."
--
Sir Tim
~misfit~
2018-08-24 01:13:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned
it down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like Fred's ego won't allow him to accept the fact that none
of the top teams want him.
Horner has already bluntly rejected the idea of employing him because
of his tendency to "cause chaos" and I see that Dr Marko has now said
that Alonso "doesn't fit with us. We were negotiating with him in
2007 or 2008. His demands were very tedious back then. If you look at
his history, in McLaren and Ferrari, it was always a one-man show."
Possibly Fernandos ego but I wouldn't put any money on Marko telling the
truth. Horner seems a bit more honest but frankly clarity and openness
aren't what you get from F1 teams when it comes to them talking about driver
negotiations.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
Sir Tim
2018-08-24 07:42:43 UTC
Permalink
... clarity and openness
aren't what you get from F1 teams when it comes to them talking about driver
negotiations.
How true, how very true! :-)

I suspect that Alonso - knowing that his chances of another WDC were
practically zilch - made the decision to abandon F1 some time ago. He was
very well received at Indy last year and is popular in America.

Shame really, because he *is* a terrific driver.
--
Sir Tim
~misfit~
2018-08-24 10:00:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sir Tim
... clarity and openness
aren't what you get from F1 teams when it comes to them talking
about driver negotiations.
How true, how very true! :-)
I suspect that Alonso - knowing that his chances of another WDC were
practically zilch - made the decision to abandon F1 some time ago. He
was very well received at Indy last year and is popular in America.
Shame really, because he *is* a terrific driver.
I agree - on all counts. Then again having him race in Indycars (assuming a
good car) would be a really interesting comparison between a fairly well
known quantity in F1 compared with the quality of the Indy field.

(I see Chilton's still running around in Indycars, usually several laps down
by the end of the race.)
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
Bruce Hoult
2018-08-24 02:16:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sir Tim
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like Fred’s ego won’t allow him to accept the fact that none of the
top teams want him.
Horner has already bluntly rejected the idea of employing him because of
his tendency to “cause chaos” and I see that Dr Marko has now said that
Alonso "doesn't fit with us. We were negotiating with him in 2007 or 2008.
His demands were very tedious back then. If you look at his history, in
McLaren and Ferrari, it was always a one-man show."
It has the ring of truth.

I've also heard from many sources that although Alonso can drive the ring off whatever he's given, he's not much use in helping to improve it.
M2T
2018-08-24 11:43:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sir Tim
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like Fred’s ego won’t allow him to accept the fact that none of the
top teams want him.
Horner has already bluntly rejected the idea of employing him because of
his tendency to “cause chaos” and I see that Dr Marko has now said that
Alonso "doesn't fit with us. We were negotiating with him in 2007 or 2008.
His demands were very tedious back then. If you look at his history, in
McLaren and Ferrari, it was always a one-man show."
It might have been a windup by Horner. Keping asking Fred about joining
RB, when he accepts, they turn him down.

I see the Toyota team are getting it in the neck for running away with
the LMP1 WEC races. They've been winning races with multiple laps in
hand, with the winner getting the nod from the team. Obviously LMP1
races are nothing like F1, where there are at least 6 cars in with a
chance of winning. Despite all that, Fred reckons it's great racing.
What I'd expect of driver who continues to claim his 2008 Singapore race
win.
News
2018-08-24 12:18:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sir Tim
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like Fred’s ego won’t allow him to accept the fact that none of the
top teams want him.
Horner has already bluntly rejected the idea of employing him because of
his tendency to “cause chaos” and I see that Dr Marko has now said that
Alonso "doesn't fit with us. We were negotiating with him in 2007 or 2008.
His demands were very tedious back then. If you look at his history, in
McLaren and Ferrari, it was always a one-man show."
For sure, Marko is a one-man show...
larkim
2018-08-24 11:41:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like plausible deniability.

CH - "So Fernando, had you ever thought about driving for Red Bull?"
FA - "No thanks"

No offer made, but a polite enquiry etc.
M2T
2018-08-24 11:44:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by larkim
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Sounds like plausible deniability.
CH - "So Fernando, had you ever thought about driving for Red Bull?"
FA - "No thanks"
Pity, 'cos we've spent a week building your soap cart.
Post by larkim
No offer made, but a polite enquiry etc.
Sir Tim
2018-08-24 12:15:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Brundle today: “I’d be surprised if Red Bull offered him a drive; I’d be
even more surprised if he turned it down!”
M2T
2018-08-24 12:29:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sir Tim
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Brundle today: “I’d be surprised if Red Bull offered him a drive; I’d be
even more surprised if he turned it down!”
Fred has a manager, who is the contact between the teams and driver.
Fred's manager is Flavio - nuff said.
Sir Tim
2018-08-24 13:21:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Post by Sir Tim
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Brundle today: “I’d be surprised if Red Bull offered him a drive; I’d be
even more surprised if he turned it down!”
Fred has a manager, who is the contact between the teams and driver.
Fred's manager is Flavio - nuff said.
Indeed!
M2T
2018-08-25 04:11:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned it
down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Joe Saward's response to Fred's claim


"...Well, I'll tell you a story. In Baku I was talking to a senior Red
Bull Racing individual known as Christian and Flavio Briatore
approached: "Oh God," Christian said (Sorry if this sounds like
Pilgrim's Progess). "He's trying to sell me Alonso again. We don't want
him." I was not surprised by responded: "You don't want him?". Christian
looked to the skies and said: "We have no interest in him at all". I
will leave it to you to figure out who is telling the truth in this case..."
~misfit~
2018-08-26 03:22:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by M2T
Post by M2T
Fred is claiming he was offered Ricciardo's Red Bull seat and turned
it down.
Horner says he wasn't.
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11480137/fernando-alonso-rejected-red-bull
Joe Saward's response to Fred's claim
"...Well, I'll tell you a story. In Baku I was talking to a senior Red
Bull Racing individual known as Christian and Flavio Briatore
approached: "Oh God," Christian said (Sorry if this sounds like
Pilgrim's Progess). "He's trying to sell me Alonso again. We don't
want him." I was not surprised by responded: "You don't want him?".
Christian looked to the skies and said: "We have no interest in him
at all". I will leave it to you to figure out who is telling the truth in
this
case..."
From what I can gather Horner *did* have a meeting with Flavio about Alonso
a wee while back and Flavio over-represented Red Bulls interest to Alonso.
So, when Alonso made the statement he fully believed he'd been made an offer
(and got very upset when Horner dismissed it out of hand - with insults to
boot).

So the answer to the titular question is Flavio Briatore.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
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