Discussion:
Bye bye F1....
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~misfit~
2018-05-06 06:05:39 UTC
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I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice up the
off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from the NFL draft.
WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league if he didn't actually
want F1 per se? Where will it end?

The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$ started to
rule F1.

* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even explain WTF
the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia for that. A large part
of the US population seems to think that either the whole world knows all
about its peculiar habits or doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care
that they might not...
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
M2T
2018-05-06 11:27:10 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice up the
off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from the NFL draft.
WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league if he didn't actually
want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$ started to
rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even explain WTF
the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia for that. A large part
of the US population seems to think that either the whole world knows all
about its peculiar habits or doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care
that they might not...
You need to catch up.

Motorsport Network - The company owns and operates its offices in Miami
and London. As of 2017, The network now features its properties serve 81
countries in 17 languages and has 550 employees across the world who
publish 27 global editions of its websites, social media channels and
magazines.

Chairman - Zak Brown. Which accounts for the constant stream of
bollocks being published about McLaren, despite them currently being a
shit F1 team, who can't get a decent sponsor.

You won't read anything anti-septic from any of the main stream F1
publications, 'cos they own them all. Including the likes of James
Allen, who's getting wll paid to promote F1 computer games as the future
of the sport.

Liberty (look up the meaning of the word) Media have already forced all
the drivers to attend any pre-race events they might run. I expect they
will deny them a winter break to get them to turn up to any number of
bollocks PR events throughout the winter too.
~misfit~
2018-05-06 13:27:28 UTC
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Post by M2T
Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice
up the off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from
the NFL draft. WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league
if he didn't actually want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$
started to rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even
explain WTF the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia
for that. A large part of the US population seems to think that
either the whole world knows all about its peculiar habits or
doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care that they might
not...
You need to catch up.
I try but it's a moving target.
Post by M2T
Motorsport Network - The company owns and operates its offices in
Miami and London. As of 2017, The network now features its properties
serve 81 countries in 17 languages and has 550 employees across the
world who publish 27 global editions of its websites, social media
channels and magazines.
Chairman - Zak Brown. Which accounts for the constant stream of
bollocks being published about McLaren, despite them currently being a
shit F1 team, who can't get a decent sponsor.
I was aware of most of that.
Post by M2T
You won't read anything anti-septic from any of the main stream F1
publications, 'cos they own them all. Including the likes of James
Allen, who's getting wll paid to promote F1 computer games as the
future of the sport.
Yep.
Post by M2T
Liberty (look up the meaning of the word)
I'm aware of the irony.
Post by M2T
Media have already forced
all the drivers to attend any pre-race events they might run. I
expect they will deny them a winter break to get them to turn up to
any number of bollocks PR events throughout the winter too.
I knew we'd stepped through the looking-glass when Trump got elected. I
guess I just expected F1 to take a little longer to be turned into a
caricature of itself, a US-themed international clone of Indycars /
Nascars...

Now I'm starting to hope that the major teams *do* walk out over the cost
caps / dumping of the MGU-H and start a rival formula. I'll be following
that one if so.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-06 23:08:05 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I knew we'd stepped through the looking-glass when Trump got elected.
When you say 'we'.
Do you mean sheep fucking losers,
living on government hand-outs,
pirating F1 tv coverage?
FB
2018-05-06 11:40:46 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice up the
off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from the NFL draft.
WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league if he didn't actually
want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$ started to
rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even explain WTF
the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia for that. A large
part of the US population seems to think that either the whole world knows
all about its peculiar habits or doesn't think enough of non-US citizens
to care that they might not...
--
Shaun.
it's the redneckzation of F1, soon they will replace the podium champagne
with moonshine and will ask the drivers to learn to play the banjo...

FB
~misfit~
2018-05-06 13:20:59 UTC
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Post by FB
Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice
up the off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from
the NFL draft. WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league
if he didn't actually want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$
started to rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even
explain WTF the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia
for that. A large part of the US population seems to think that
either the whole world knows all about its peculiar habits or
doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care that they might
not... --
Shaun.
it's the redneckzation of F1,
How true.

soon they will replace the podium
Post by FB
champagne with moonshine and will ask the drivers to learn to play
the banjo...
Damn sister-loving Merkins!
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
News
2018-05-06 14:30:48 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
Post by FB
Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice
up the off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from
the NFL draft. WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league
if he didn't actually want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$
started to rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even
explain WTF the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia
for that. A large part of the US population seems to think that
either the whole world knows all about its peculiar habits or
doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care that they might
not... --
Shaun.
it's the redneckzation of F1,
How true.
soon they will replace the podium
Post by FB
champagne with moonshine and will ask the drivers to learn to play
the banjo...
Damn sister-loving Merkins!
F1's Deliverance...
Bigbird
2018-05-06 19:26:09 UTC
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Post by News
Post by ~misfit~
Post by FB
Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to
"spice up the off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget
coming from the NFL draft. WTF??? Why didn't he just start his
own racing league if he didn't actually want F1 per se? Where
will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$
started to rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even
explain WTF the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to
Wikipedia for that. A large part of the US population seems to
think that either the whole world knows all about its peculiar
habits or doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care that
they might not... --
Shaun.
it's the redneckzation of F1,
How true.
soon they will replace the podium
Post by FB
champagne with moonshine and will ask the drivers to learn to play
the banjo...
Damn sister-loving Merkins!
F1's Deliverance...
:thumbsup:
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-06 23:15:03 UTC
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Post by News
F1's Deliverance...
You 2 lovers better get a room.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-06 23:10:40 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
Damn sister-loving Merkins!
Sheep fucking loser.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-06 23:09:38 UTC
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Post by FB
it's the redneckzation of F1, soon they will replace the podium champagne
with moonshine and will ask the drivers to learn to play the banjo...
Don't quit your day job. Stupid.
John
2018-05-06 19:20:07 UTC
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The off season should be made shorter. Start by adding a race somewhere in Africa, probably return the South Africa event.
Bigbird
2018-05-06 19:28:07 UTC
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Post by John
The off season should be made shorter. Start by adding a race
somewhere in Africa, probably return the South Africa event.
OTOH why take a year out and decide WTF they want F1 to be.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-06 23:04:34 UTC
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A large part of the US population seems to think that either the whole world knows all about its peculiar habits
Your sheep fucking is not peculiar? Fucking weirdo.
D Munz
2018-05-07 11:49:58 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice up the
off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from the NFL draft.
WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league if he didn't actually
want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$ started to
rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even explain WTF
the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia for that. A large part
of the US population seems to think that either the whole world knows all
about its peculiar habits or doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care
that they might not...
--
Shaun.
"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
In defense of all things Liberty (I know, a bad place to start...) I'm not sure it is completely about the money. I think they are looking to keep the buzz going over the off-season. Years ago, the NFL draft was an ignored snoozefest. Now it is almost a sporting event on its own. I was in Los Vegas just before the draft and the sports books were taking bets on all aspects of the draft.

I suspect that Liberty see the break as a void that can be filled to keep folks interested. (Primarily in America, no doubt.)

I'm not sure what this looks like but consider the annual awards ceremony. Has it ever been televised? That level of glitz and glam could rival some of the entertainment award shows.

What I don't think we will see is the redneckisation of F1. That crowd is is genetically boufght and sold by NAZCAR. They will never be moved. What Liberty is looking for are the 20-40 year old market with free cash. How that crowd is engaged will determine the future of F1.

FWIW
DLM
~misfit~
2018-05-07 23:46:21 UTC
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Post by D Munz
Post by ~misfit~
I see an artcile at motorsport.com* that Chase Carey wants to "spice
up the off-season" with the inspiration for that nugget coming from
the NFL draft. WTF??? Why didn't he just start his own racing league
if he didn't actually want F1 per se? Where will it end?
The sky is falling and I thought it might when the mighty US$
started to rule F1.
* The freakin' arrogance of motorsport.com - they didn't even
explain WTF the NFL draft actually was - I had to go to Wikipedia
for that. A large part of the US population seems to think that
either the whole world knows all about its peculiar habits or
doesn't think enough of non-US citizens to care that they might
not... --
Shaun.
In defense of all things Liberty (I know, a bad place to start...)
I'm not sure it is completely about the money.
I beg to differ. Business corporations exists to make money and while
individuals can be altruistic it goes against what a business is there for.
Everything that they do will be to increase revenue.
Post by D Munz
I think they are
looking to keep the buzz going over the off-season. Years ago, the
NFL draft was an ignored snoozefest. Now it is almost a sporting
event on its own. I was in Los Vegas just before the draft and the
sports books were taking bets on all aspects of the draft.
Yeah I read that on Wikipedia after reading th artcile saying Carey wanted
something along those lines for F1.
Post by D Munz
I suspect that Liberty see the break as a void that can be filled to
keep folks interested. (Primarily in America, no doubt.)
I would have thought that maybe giving people access to the last seasons
action free in the off-season would do more along those lines. The last
thing we need is for the drivers to have an increased workload in their
precious down-time. As it is they're often very busy with sponsor
sweeteners...
Post by D Munz
I'm not sure what this looks like but consider the annual awards
ceremony. Has it ever been televised? That level of glitz and glam
could rival some of the entertainment award shows.
As a decades long F1 fan I can honestly say that I would have no interest
whatsoever in watching that. "Glitz and Glam" as the main part of 'the show'
is anathema to me. I don't watch the Monaco race for the glitterati, I just
accept that it's part of the tradition - But maybe that's just me.
Post by D Munz
What I don't think we will see is the redneckisation of F1. That
crowd is is genetically boufght and sold by NAZCAR. They will never
be moved.
From what little I know of the subject you're probably right. However that
whole 'showbiz' introduction thing at last years COTA GP was extremely
cringe-worthy to a traditional F1 fan.
Post by D Munz
What Liberty is looking for are the 20-40 year old market
with free cash. How that crowd is engaged will determine the future
of F1.
IMO F1s appeal is in it's uniqueness. If Liberty start taking cues from
other sports and applyng them to F1 then they risk losing its identity - and
the existing fan base. There are a lot of motorsport series, IMO Liberty
should be looking closely at what makes F1 unique and, if they must change
anything then play to its strengths. I have the increasing feeling that
we're now seeing the last of the 'good old days'....

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-08 00:19:37 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
But maybe that's just me.
Yup, an idiot
Post by ~misfit~
However that whole 'showbiz' introduction thing at last years COTA GP was > extremely cringe-worthy to a traditional F1 fan.
Do all traditionalist pirate their F1 tv coverage, like you?
Post by ~misfit~
I have the increasing feeling that we're now seeing the last of the 'good old days'....
of no passing?
Sir Tim
2018-05-08 07:19:43 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I have the increasing feeling that
we're now seeing the last of the 'good old days'....
People said that in 1960 (and at many other times in F1 history). Not
saying that Liberty are going the right way, just that one has to be
careful before playing the “good old days” card.
--
Sir Tim
~misfit~
2018-05-08 08:36:02 UTC
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Post by Sir Tim
Post by ~misfit~
I have the increasing feeling that
we're now seeing the last of the 'good old days'....
People said that in 1960 (and at many other times in F1 history). Not
saying that Liberty are going the right way, just that one has to be
careful before playing the "good old days" card.
I've been following F1 for decades watching every race, live before my
accident cost me luxuries and delayed since then. Before I followed it for
every race I watched highlights packages, read F1 news and was still very
interested. I know it's not as long as some here but I've been an F2 fan for
about 45 years.

Yes there have been a lot of changes along the way but (IMO) none as big as
having an American media compay calling the shots (in the time of Trump). F1
has always been euro-centric (Brexit aside). Yes there are or have been
races in the Middle East, India and Asia but at it's heart it's always been
European. That's changing now - I think that qualifies for 'the good old
days' card....
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
D Munz
2018-05-08 12:09:29 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
Yes there have been a lot of changes along the way but (IMO) none as big as
having an American media compay calling the shots (in the time of Trump). F1
has always been euro-centric (Brexit aside). Yes there are or have been
races in the Middle East, India and Asia but at it's heart it's always been
European. That's changing now - I think that qualifies for 'the good old
days' card....
--
I don't think this is really any different than what Bernie did. I still believe that the move out of Europe was originally about chasing tobacco money. It quickly morphed into which despot could pay the largest fee.

What is happening now is that the money had moved. No more tobacco and the despots are all drying up. Liberty is just looking for the next pot of gold. If they believe that it is in the pockets of those who want glam and rock concerts so be it.

As long as the show goes on and it doesn't intrude between lights out and the checkered flag, we can ignore the noise.

FWIW
DLM
~misfit~
2018-05-10 02:46:33 UTC
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Post by D Munz
Post by ~misfit~
Yes there have been a lot of changes along the way but (IMO) none as
big as having an American media compay calling the shots (in the
time of Trump). F1 has always been euro-centric (Brexit aside). Yes
there are or have been races in the Middle East, India and Asia but
at it's heart it's always been European. That's changing now - I
think that qualifies for 'the good old days' card....
--
I don't think this is really any different than what Bernie did. I
still believe that the move out of Europe was originally about
chasing tobacco money. It quickly morphed into which despot could
pay the largest fee.
Yep. However it was still an international 'sport'.
Post by D Munz
What is happening now is that the money had moved. No more tobacco
and the despots are all drying up. Liberty is just looking for the
next pot of gold. If they believe that it is in the pockets of those
who want glam and rock concerts so be it.
As well as the glitz and glam there's also the trend towards more US races.
No tmany other countries get more than one race - and TTBOMK none on a
reguar basis. My concern is the more races there are in the US the more
Americanised the whole shebang will become - which would tend towards even
more g & g and dilute the whole unique F1 culture.
Post by D Munz
As long as the show goes on and it doesn't intrude between lights out
and the checkered flag, we can ignore the noise.
True. However if the trend towards more US races continues teams and
manufacturers might cease to see F1 as being an international stage.

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-10 21:48:26 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
My concern is the more races there are in the US the more
Americanised the whole shebang will become
Your concern has no weight.
Because you are a pirating thief
of F1 tv coverage. So fuck you
and your concern.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-10 22:07:20 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
TTBOMK
Shove that acronym up your cunt.
You goofy bitch.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-11 00:28:47 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
there's also the trend towards more US races.
if the trend towards more US races continues
There is one US race.
Tell your dumb doctor
that your excessive meds
are fucking up your math skills.
You American bashing, sheep fucking,
loser, whiny, government hand-out,
cry baby, tit.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-09 00:55:00 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I've been following F1 for decades watching every race, live before my
accident cost me luxuries and delayed since then.
All accidents are preventable.
Quit fucking crying you dumb bitch,
about your sad and sorry life.
You pirating, thief, piece of shit.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-09 00:57:19 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
Yes there are or have been
races in the Middle East, India and Asia but at it's heart it's always been
European. That's changing now - I think that qualifies for 'the good old
days' card....
Fucking racist piece of shit.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-09 01:19:08 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I've been following F1 for decades watching every race, live before my
accident cost me luxuries and delayed since then.
That gives you a right to pirate F1 tv coverage?
Get fucked, asshole.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-09 01:31:12 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
I've been following F1 for decades watching every race, live before my
accident cost me luxuries and delayed since then. Before I followed it for
every race I watched highlights packages, read F1 news and was still very
interested. I know it's not as long as some here but I've been an F2 fan for
about 45 years.
Yes there have been a lot of changes along the way but (IMO) none as big as
having an American media compay calling the shots (in the time of Trump). F1
has always been euro-centric (Brexit aside). Yes there are or have been
races in the Middle East, India and Asia but at it's heart it's always been
European. That's changing now - I think that qualifies for 'the good old
days' card....
Stop fucking crying and whining and bitching here.
Instead, get off your fat cunt, and get some exercise.
And fix your fucking bad back, and oh poor me attitude.
Being a deluxe cunt doesn't help either.
D Munz
2018-05-08 12:03:20 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
Post by D Munz
In defense of all things Liberty (I know, a bad place to start...)
I'm not sure it is completely about the money.
I beg to differ. Business corporations exists to make money and while
individuals can be altruistic it goes against what a business is there for.
Everything that they do will be to increase revenue.
Yes, they are in it for the money. (I should add that as a shareholder I suppose I am too.) But this won't be about direct revenue. I think they are looking at using the downtime to generate/maintain interest in a demographic (20 - 40 year old) that is easily distracted.
Post by ~misfit~
From what little I know of the subject you're probably right. However that
whole 'showbiz' introduction thing at last years COTA GP was extremely
cringe-worthy to a traditional F1 fan.
As an American and, more importantly, a Texan, I was revolted. I don't know where that idea came from but it needs to be burred in a deep dark hole and covered with concrete. I don't watch any NASCAR but I suspect that would be over the top even for them.

FWIW
DLM
M2T
2018-05-08 12:15:25 UTC
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Post by D Munz
Yes, they are in it for the money. (I should add that as a shareholder I suppose I am too.) But this won't be about direct revenue. I think they are looking at using the downtime to generate/maintain interest in a demographic (20 - 40 year old) that is easily distracted.
Everyone is easily distracted, especially those who watch sport at home.
Even those who've paid out to watch live sport don't watch every minute.
I've sat in the stands at major races and seen hundreds of people
wandering around behind the circuit and they're not all off to the bogs.

All sports have off seasons. Not getting what you fancy increases the
pleasure when you do get it.
larkim
2018-05-08 13:13:45 UTC
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Post by M2T
Post by D Munz
Yes, they are in it for the money. (I should add that as a shareholder I suppose I am too.) But this won't be about direct revenue. I think they are looking at using the downtime to generate/maintain interest in a demographic (20 - 40 year old) that is easily distracted.
Everyone is easily distracted, especially those who watch sport at home.
Even those who've paid out to watch live sport don't watch every minute.
I've sat in the stands at major races and seen hundreds of people
wandering around behind the circuit and they're not all off to the bogs.
All sports have off seasons. Not getting what you fancy increases the
pleasure when you do get it.
I don't see what the issue with the original article was.

Carey wants to spice up the off season with the draft just being a "good
example" of how the NFL does that.

We've got testing, which spices things up a little but very close to the
new season start.

Soccer-ball has international tours of friendlies as "pre-season" interest
that seems to appeal. They also have summer tournaments every few years.

What sorts of off-season things could they come up with? Difficult with
individual drivers, can't see them getting a load of them to do a rally
season or race of champions etc because of the risk that it will change
the public's perception of who is "good" and who isn't. Though it would
be nice to have something a little racing-related and light-hearted, maybe
a karting cup (ignoring my own arguments above!).

Maybe have a young driver test closer to Christmas, rather than straight
after the final race. A fitness TV programme like Superstars only for F1
drivers. It's A Knockout!

I've got no other sport to be particularly interested in over the winter
so I'd appreciate the sport having a more year round appeal TBH.
~misfit~
2018-05-10 02:39:15 UTC
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Post by D Munz
Post by ~misfit~
Post by D Munz
In defense of all things Liberty (I know, a bad place to start...)
I'm not sure it is completely about the money.
I beg to differ. Business corporations exists to make money and while
individuals can be altruistic it goes against what a business is
there for. Everything that they do will be to increase revenue.
Yes, they are in it for the money. (I should add that as a
shareholder I suppose I am too.) But this won't be about direct
revenue. I think they are looking at using the downtime to
generate/maintain interest in a demographic (20 - 40 year old) that
is easily distracted.
... for the express purpose of extracting money from them. ;-)
Post by D Munz
Post by ~misfit~
From what little I know of the subject you're probably right.
However that whole 'showbiz' introduction thing at last years COTA
GP was extremely cringe-worthy to a traditional F1 fan.
As an American and, more importantly, a Texan, I was revolted. I
don't know where that idea came from but it needs to be burred in a
deep dark hole and covered with concrete. I don't watch any NASCAR
but I suspect that would be over the top even for them.
Good to know we're on the same page about that.

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-11 04:11:24 UTC
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Good to know we're on the same page about that.
Fuck you asshole. Cunthole.
t***@gmail.com
2018-05-11 04:28:44 UTC
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Post by ~misfit~
Good to know we're on the same page about that.
As pleasurable as new box of
government hand-out senior diapers?

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