Discussion:
DOTD
(too old to reply)
Duddie
2017-09-03 13:47:02 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
HAM & RIC

Both in their class.
Sir Tim
2017-09-03 13:55:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
+1
--
Sir Tim
Yuhler Speertraeger
2017-09-03 18:55:13 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
+1
+2
--
Best,
Yuhler

Reply-To: partially ROT13, invalid=com
Due to spam I'm filtering-out GoogleGroups. Sorry. :(
Stephen Thomas Cole
2017-09-03 18:56:35 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
+1
+2
Just RIC for me. Lewis driving off to victory right from lights out is
exactly what should have happened, with that car, at that track, driven by
that driver. A beautiful thing, no mistake, but not remarkable, IMO.
Ricciardo's result, though, was awesome. Big hat-tip to Stroll and Ocon,
too.
--
STC / M0TEY /
http://twitter.com/ukradioamateur
Bigbird
2017-09-03 19:21:02 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Stephen Thomas Cole
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
+1
+2
Just RIC for me. Lewis driving off to victory right from lights out is
exactly what should have happened, with that car, at that track,
driven by that driver. A beautiful thing, no mistake, but not
remarkable, IMO. Ricciardo's result, though, was awesome. Big
hat-tip to Stroll and Ocon, too.
I'd go along with that. Hamilton did the better part of his job on
Saturday, Sunday he relied on Stroll and Ocon not hitting him then made
off.
~misfit~
2017-09-04 11:06:39 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Stephen Thomas Cole
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
+1
+2
Just RIC for me. Lewis driving off to victory right from lights out is
exactly what should have happened, with that car, at that track,
driven by that driver. A beautiful thing, no mistake, but not
remarkable, IMO. Ricciardo's result, though, was awesome. Big hat-tip
to Stroll and Ocon, too.
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short time. I
still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved that at least he's
a quick learner. Ocon's always impressed me and I think will one day be
regularly winning races. It's just a shame that the friction between Perez
and him has, for now at least marred his reputation a little when IMO it's
been 90% Perez.

Cracked me up when Perez said to a Sky reporter earlier in the week that
there won't be problems between them any more. When asked why Perez said
he'd taken him aside and they'd talked, just the two of them without the
team hovering around and is was sorted. I straight away thought Perez
probably said "Keep the fuck out of my way - My backers and I know where
your family lives!"
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
Bobster
2017-09-04 17:45:34 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~misfit~
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short time. I
still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved that at least he's
a quick learner.
Here's some of what you thought:

"My take (fwiw) is that he's trying hard to please his father but, by dint of his fathers millions has been promoted beyond his skill level. Not just too soon but because he doesn't have it in him to wrestle a 1,000 hp car around a track at crazy speeds."

"It seems that he's a very slow learner which rather reinforces my point that he shouldn't be in F1."

"This is the fifth race yeah? Added to the half a dozen private sessions he had last year in a 2014 Williams and a 20 strong factory team you'd think he'd be doing better than that by now. If he was any good that is...."

"Far more money than skill. "

So what you say you STILL think isn't what you still think at all. You'd have had to have thought that previously to still be thinking it.
Sir Tim
2017-09-04 21:59:51 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bobster
Post by ~misfit~
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short time. I
still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved that at least he's
a quick learner.
"My take (fwiw) is that he's trying hard to please his father but, by
dint of his fathers millions has been promoted beyond his skill level.
Not just too soon but because he doesn't have it in him to wrestle a
1,000 hp car around a track at crazy speeds."
"It seems that he's a very slow learner which rather reinforces my point
that he shouldn't be in F1."
"This is the fifth race yeah? Added to the half a dozen private sessions
he had last year in a 2014 Williams and a 20 strong factory team you'd
think he'd be doing better than that by now. If he was any good that is...."
"Far more money than skill. "
So what you say you STILL think isn't what you still think at all. You'd
have had to have thought that previously to still be thinking it.
That's all rather convoluted! Most of us are occasionally prone to making
snap judgments based more on our prejudices than the facts but it takes
character to admit that we might have been wrong.
--
Sir Tim
Bobster
2017-09-05 02:36:42 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sir Tim
Post by Bobster
Post by ~misfit~
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short time. I
still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved that at least he's
a quick learner.
"My take (fwiw) is that he's trying hard to please his father but, by
dint of his fathers millions has been promoted beyond his skill level.
Not just too soon but because he doesn't have it in him to wrestle a
1,000 hp car around a track at crazy speeds."
"It seems that he's a very slow learner which rather reinforces my point
that he shouldn't be in F1."
"This is the fifth race yeah? Added to the half a dozen private sessions
he had last year in a 2014 Williams and a 20 strong factory team you'd
think he'd be doing better than that by now. If he was any good that is...."
"Far more money than skill. "
So what you say you STILL think isn't what you still think at all. You'd
have had to have thought that previously to still be thinking it.
That's all rather convoluted! Most of us are occasionally prone to making
snap judgments based more on our prejudices than the facts but it takes
character to admit that we might have been wrong.
It wasn't a single snap judgement and he hasn't admitted he was wrong.
Bigbird
2017-09-05 10:04:59 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bobster
Post by ~misfit~
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short
time. I >> still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved
that at least he's >> a quick learner.
Post by Bobster
"My take (fwiw) is that he's trying hard to please his father but,
by dint of his fathers millions has been promoted beyond his skill
level. Not just too soon but because he doesn't have it in him to
wrestle a 1,000 hp car around a track at crazy speeds."
"It seems that he's a very slow learner which rather reinforces my
point that he shouldn't be in F1."
"This is the fifth race yeah? Added to the half a dozen private
sessions he had last year in a 2014 Williams and a 20 strong
factory team you'd think he'd be doing better than that by now. If
he was any good that is...."
"Far more money than skill. "
So what you say you STILL think isn't what you still think at all.
You'd have had to have thought that previously to still be thinking
it.
That's all rather convoluted! Most of us are occasionally prone to
making snap judgments based more on our prejudices than the facts but
it takes character to admit that we might have been wrong.
It's just Bobby showing what a nasty piece of work he can be.

Shaun knows what he said and that he went a little far in justifying a
rash judgement.

Bob's attempt to humiliate him for it just humiliates himself.

All best ignored.
t***@gmail.com
2017-09-06 01:11:59 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bigbird
It's just Bobby showing what a nasty piece of work he can be.
Shaun knows what he said and that he went a little far in justifying a
rash judgement.
Bob's attempt to humiliate him for it just humiliates himself.
All best ignored.
lol
~misfit~
2017-09-06 05:50:44 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bigbird
Post by Bobster
Post by ~misfit~
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short
time. I >> still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved
that at least he's >> a quick learner.
Post by Bobster
"My take (fwiw) is that he's trying hard to please his father but,
by dint of his fathers millions has been promoted beyond his skill
level. Not just too soon but because he doesn't have it in him to
wrestle a 1,000 hp car around a track at crazy speeds."
"It seems that he's a very slow learner which rather reinforces my
point that he shouldn't be in F1."
"This is the fifth race yeah? Added to the half a dozen private
sessions he had last year in a 2014 Williams and a 20 strong
factory team you'd think he'd be doing better than that by now. If
he was any good that is...."
"Far more money than skill. "
So what you say you STILL think isn't what you still think at all.
You'd have had to have thought that previously to still be thinking
it.
That's all rather convoluted! Most of us are occasionally prone to
making snap judgments based more on our prejudices than the facts but
it takes character to admit that we might have been wrong.
It's just Bobby showing what a nasty piece of work he can be.
Shaun knows what he said and that he went a little far in justifying a
rash judgement.
Or something along those lines. ;)
Post by Bigbird
Bob's attempt to humiliate him for it just humiliates himself.
All best ignored.
Indeed.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
~misfit~
2017-09-06 05:49:37 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Sir Tim
Post by Bobster
Post by ~misfit~
Agreed about the young fellas. Stroll's come a long way in a short
time. I still think he was thrown in the deep end but he's proved
that at least he's a quick learner.
"My take (fwiw) is that he's trying hard to please his father but, by
dint of his fathers millions has been promoted beyond his skill level.
Not just too soon but because he doesn't have it in him to wrestle a
1,000 hp car around a track at crazy speeds."
"It seems that he's a very slow learner which rather reinforces my
point that he shouldn't be in F1."
"This is the fifth race yeah? Added to the half a dozen private sessions
he had last year in a 2014 Williams and a 20 strong factory team
you'd think he'd be doing better than that by now. If he was any
good that is...."
"Far more money than skill. "
So what you say you STILL think isn't what you still think at all.
You'd have had to have thought that previously to still be thinking
it.
That's all rather convoluted! Most of us are occasionally prone to
making snap judgments based more on our prejudices than the facts but
it takes character to admit that we might have been wrong.
Thanks for that. I'd like to say I'm the first to say when I've been wrong
but with Bob aroud that would be very difficult indeed.

This backs up perfectly what I said about Bob in a different thread
recently. To spend all of that time cherry-picking my previous comments and
then implying that what I said was not only set in stone but also the only
thoughts I had on the subject says far more about him than it does me.

LOL I just read some of what BOB quoted and in fact most of it doesn't
contradict what I said the other day at all. It's just that I didn't write
every single thought I had on the subject and most of those quoted comments
only need a word or two added (which there's a good chance I left out for
the sake of brevity) to completely back up what I said the other day.

Sad. Very sad.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)
t***@gmail.com
2017-09-06 15:32:42 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by ~misfit~
Sad. Very sad.
Yes you are. Pathetic actually.

Botham
2017-09-03 19:48:55 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
Next time try watching the actual race. Bottas was faster and passed 4 cars. Of course the team then made sure he wasn't allowed to race the 'chump' in front.
Anyone on the grid would have lapped the field in the oil burning supercar.
geoff
2017-09-03 21:24:02 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Botham
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
Next time try watching the actual race. Bottas was faster and passed 4 cars. Of course the team then made sure he wasn't allowed to race the 'chump' in front.
Yeah HAM was clearly inferior and didn't pass any cars ( other than
lapped lamers of course).

geoff
Brian W Lawrence
2017-09-04 08:21:09 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Botham
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
Next time try watching the actual race.
Bottas was faster and passed 4 cars.
Four? Raikkonen, lap 1; Stroll, lap 3; Ocon, lap 4; & ...

If he was faster he would have won the race, but he completed the race
distance 4.471s slower than Hamilton. Hamilton's fastest lap was about
0.25s faster than Bottas', though Ricciardo was quicker than both.

Over 51 laps where both Mercedes drivers were running (excluding 2 pit
stop laps), Hamilton was quicker than Bottas on 30 laps, while Bottas
was quicker than Hamilton on 21. Neither driver needed to go any faster
than they did - one or the other might be slower because of traffic or
making a slight error.
Post by Botham
Of course the team then made sure he wasn't allowed to race the 'chump' in front.
Anyone on the grid would have lapped the field in the oil burning supercar.
And 'anyone' doing so would have been stupid, and would probably be out
of a drive.

The last time the winner 'lapped the field' was in 1995 (Damon Hill, AUS
G~P). McLaren were the last team to do it with any regularity (both
drivers) - in the 'eighties. Williams (Mansell/Patrese) did it once in
1992 (BRA).

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Bruce Hoult
2017-09-04 08:25:41 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Brian W Lawrence
Post by Botham
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
Next time try watching the actual race.
Bottas was faster and passed 4 cars.
Four? Raikkonen, lap 1; Stroll, lap 3; Ocon, lap 4; & ...
If he was faster he would have won the race, but he completed the race
distance 4.471s slower than Hamilton. Hamilton's fastest lap was about
0.25s faster than Bottas', though Ricciardo was quicker than both.
Over 51 laps where both Mercedes drivers were running (excluding 2 pit
stop laps), Hamilton was quicker than Bottas on 30 laps, while Bottas
was quicker than Hamilton on 21. Neither driver needed to go any faster
than they did - one or the other might be slower because of traffic or
making a slight error.
Post by Botham
Of course the team then made sure he wasn't allowed to race the 'chump' in front.
Anyone on the grid would have lapped the field in the oil burning supercar.
And 'anyone' doing so would have been stupid, and would probably be out
of a drive.
The last time the winner 'lapped the field' was in 1995 (Damon Hill, AUS
G~P). McLaren were the last team to do it with any regularity (both
drivers) - in the 'eighties. Williams (Mansell/Patrese) did it once in
1992 (BRA).
I seem to recall we've had "everyone lapped except those on the podium" recently. Even this year?
Brian W Lawrence
2017-09-04 09:15:57 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bruce Hoult
Post by Brian W Lawrence
The last time the winner 'lapped the field' was in 1995 (Damon Hill, AUS
G~P). McLaren were the last team to do it with any regularity (both
drivers) - in the 'eighties. Williams (Mansell/Patrese) did it once in
1992 (BRA).
I seem to recall we've had "everyone lapped except those on the podium" recently. Even this year?
Spanish GP, HAM, VET, RIC lapped all others.

I don't appear to have any record of any earlier instances though I'm
sure there must have been quite a lot.




---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Brian W Lawrence
2017-09-04 09:45:17 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Brian W Lawrence
Post by Bruce Hoult
Post by Brian W Lawrence
The last time the winner 'lapped the field' was in 1995 (Damon Hill, AUS
G~P). McLaren were the last team to do it with any regularity (both
drivers) - in the 'eighties. Williams (Mansell/Patrese) did it once in
1992 (BRA).
I seem to recall we've had "everyone lapped except those on the
podium" recently. Even this year?
Spanish GP, HAM, VET, RIC lapped all others.
I don't appear to have any record of any earlier instances though I'm
sure there must have been quite a lot.
ESP 2017 was the first since GBR 2008. Eight others since 1999.



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Brian W Lawrence
2017-09-04 09:12:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Brian W Lawrence
The last time the winner 'lapped the field' was in 1995 (Damon Hill, AUS
G~P). McLaren were the last team to do it with any regularity (both
drivers) - in the 'eighties. Williams (Mansell/Patrese) did it once in
1992 (BRA).
Doing some checking - McLaren (Hakkinen/Coulthard) lapped everyone else
in 1998 AUS GP.


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Brian W Lawrence
2017-09-04 09:53:08 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Brian W Lawrence
Post by Brian W Lawrence
The last time the winner 'lapped the field' was in 1995 (Damon Hill,
AUS G~P). McLaren were the last team to do it with any regularity
(both drivers) - in the 'eighties. Williams (Mansell/Patrese) did it
once in 1992 (BRA).
Doing some checking - McLaren (Hakkinen/Coulthard) lapped everyone else
in 1998 AUS GP.
And even more recently - USA 2005, MSC/BAR (Ferrari) lapped everyone else.

Refining my data, team-mates finishing 1st & 2nd lapped all others:

1950s 16 times (sometimes 1st/2nd/3rd)
1960s 8
1970s 1
1980s 10
1990s 3
2000s 1
2010s 0

Since 1980:

RSA 84 Kyalami Lauda/Prost (McLaren)
GBR 86 Brands Hatch Mansell/Piquet (Williams)
AUS 87 Adelaide Berger/Alboreto (Ferrari)
AUT 87 Österreichring Mansell/Piquet (Williams)
GBR 87 Silverstone Mansell/Piquet (Williams)
BEL 87 Spa Prost/Johansson (McLaren)
RSM 88 Imola Senna/Prost (McLaren)
Det 88 Detroit Senna/Prost (McLaren)
RSM 89 Imola Senna/Prost (McLaren)
MON 89 Monte Carlo Senna/Prost (McLaren)

RSM 91 Imola Senna/Berger (McLaren)
BRA 92 Interlagos Mansell/Patrese (Williams)
AUS 98 Melbourne Hakkinen/Coulthard (McLaren)

USA 05 Indianapolis M Schumacher/Barrichello (Ferrari)




---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
John
2017-09-03 20:20:23 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Ricciardo

Points to Strole (sp?) for fading back very cleanly then being competitive.
Bobster
2017-09-04 07:51:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
Hamilton drove well, but also the Merc was clearly the best car on the track. So if Hamilton had been driving for Ferrari and Vettel for Merc?

Hamilton driving for Ferrari with Bottas and, say, Wherlein in the Mercs?

I vote for Ricciardo because he did what he does so well - drives with maximum effort the whole time and maximises every chance that comes his way. And because his move on Raikkonen was the best moment of the race.
geoff
2017-09-04 07:53:41 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bobster
Post by Duddie
HAM & RIC
Both in their class.
Hamilton drove well, but also the Merc was clearly the best car on the track. So if Hamilton had been driving for Ferrari and Vettel for Merc?
Hamilton driving for Ferrari with Bottas and, say, Wherlein in the Mercs?
I vote for Ricciardo because he did what he does so well - drives with maximum effort the whole time and maximises every chance that comes his way. And because his move on Raikkonen was the best moment of the race.
And you can just see his joyous laugh on every overtake.

geoff
Loading...